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Can the use Copper Peptides lead to too high coper levels? Login/Join
 
Location: Stockholm
Registered: 18 July 2014
Posts: 28
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I got another question regarding the relationship between copper and copper peptides.

Not sure have to formulate the question:

Will the use of copper peptides have the same effect in your body as taking copper orally either in the diet or through supplements?

I mean, it is important to monitor your copper consumption since both deficiency of copper and the opposite – getting too much copper – can be harmful.

So for example, let’s say you are getting 2 mg of copper through diet and supplements, and in addition you are using for example Skin Signals cream every day. Will that mean that your de facto consumption of copper be higher, for example the equivalent of2.5mg (or something)? Or will the cream not affect your copper levels at all in the same way as oral copper?

Or What if you are using Super Cop 2x tow times a day? Is there any level of copper peptide usage where you might get too much copper in your blood?

(I think I already know copper peptides is different since it is connected to protein and does not cause free radical damage in the same way as free copper, or excess of it, does, but I still want to know if using copper peptides can be equivalent to taking oral copper)

This is a very important question for me. The reason is that earlier I fear I made a mistake consuming too much copper as supplement. And I want to minimize my copper consumption. But I want to use SB products.
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Location: Skin Biology
Registered: 15 September 2004
Posts: 7065
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It is really hard to find evidence for copper overload in humans. Many studies from the Nutrition Laboratories of the US Department of Agriculture indicate that the optimal copper intake is about 5 to 7 mgs daily instead of the 1-2 mgs in most diets.

One of the fascinating things about copper is the precision with which this essential mineral is regulated in the body. In one study of copper transport in the blood, scientists tried to create an elevated level of copper in plasma, injecting dogs and healthy human volunteers with high doses of copper. To their amazement, all excess copper magically disappeared from the blood shortly after injection!

For example, 50 mg of copper injected in healthy human volunteers (which amounts to 25 times the recommended 2 mg of copper a day) completely cleared from the blood in just 4 hours (Gubler et al 1953).

In experimental settings, researchers gave healthy volunteers 4-8 mg of copper a day for 1 to 3 months without any adverse effects. Due to the efficient mechanism of copper homeostasis, even this high dosage didn’t change the plasma concentration (Harvey et al 2003, Turnlund et al 2005).

In a multicenter European study performed in 2000, researchers investigated the effect of extra copper on oxidative processes in the blood cells of middle aged people. Again, they were amazed that even 7 mg/day of copper taken during the 6 week period did not produce any increase in oxidative damage. On the contrary, it improved anti- oxidant defense (Rock et al 2000).

The only dietary source of copper that a person should worry about is in contaminated water, since it supplies inorganic copper not bio-complexes of copper. If you drink water that contains 4-8 mg of copper per liter as your only water source for several weeks, you may experience nausea and other gastric symptoms. However, such problems occur only in Third World countries, where water quality is low. In the United States drinking water does not contribute much to copper intake (Araya et al 2001).

As you can see, our bodies are well equipped with a system of copper balancing proteins and peptides that regulate copper absorption and elimination, swiftly correcting copper excess. Even though copper toxicity may occur (if we ingest too much copper salts or drink copper-loaded water or work in the copper industry), for the majority of us, the issue of copper deficiency is much more worrisome than that of copper excess.
Location: Stockholm
Registered: 18 July 2014
Posts: 28
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Thanks, that's very interesting!

But, with all due respect you didn't answer my main question:

Do Copper peptides have the same effect in the body as oral copper?

And, how many mg of copper do you consume when using a copper peptide cream daily? Do you have any idea?

The thing is, I used 5 - 7 mg copper supplement during a period while using copper peptides SB producs, both for skin and hair. I would like to know if I exceded the "safe level" of 10mg? Also during another period I didn't use any copper supplement but I used Super Cop X2 two times a day. How much copper did I consume?

Also, do you have a link to US Department of Agriculture saying 5 - 7 mg is the optimal copper level? I don't find information of any government agency or organisation recommending more then 1mg of copper...
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Location: Skin Biology
Registered: 15 September 2004
Posts: 7065
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This is just a few of the studies on copper in humans. I have no idea where the group that sets the RDA gets their data. It is certainly not from the scientific literature. You can to to Pubmed for the abstracts and often the free article.

The recommended levels of nutrients are from a specific government committee and only they can make recommendations. They are the same group that insisted for 50 years that cholesterol was a health hazard and now in 2015, it is ignored. In the 1960s, the medical establishment and the government told everyone to stop using butter and use margarines. The margarines had 50 to 60% trans fats at that time. The huge use of margarines probably shortened the life of tens of millions of Americans.

Even advice on salt consumption is questionable. Six European studies of thousands of heart patients found those with the lowest salt use had the highest death rate.

From Pubmed on the above cited papers above.

For example, 50 mg of copper injected in healthy human volunteers (which amounts to 25 times the recommended 2 mg of copper a day) completely cleared from the blood in just 4 hours

1.
Studies on the function and metabolism of copper.
WINTROBE MM, CARTWRIGHT GE, GUBLER CJ.
J Nutr. 1953 Aug;50(4):395-419. No abstract available.
PMID: 13085205 Free Article
Related citations
Select item 13061805
2.
Studies on copper metabolism. VIII. The correlation between the serum copper level and various serum protein fractions.
LAHEY ME, GUBLER CJ, BROWN DM, SMITH EL, JAGER BV, CARTWRIGHT GE, WINTROBE MM.
J Lab Clin Med. 1953 Jun;41(6):829-35. No abstract available.
PMID: 13061805
Related citations
Select item 13052700
3.
Studies on copper metabolism. IX. The transportation of copper in blood.
GUBLER CJ, LAHEY ME, CARTWRIGHT GE, WINTROBE MM.
J Clin Invest. 1953 May;32(5):405-14. No abstract available.
PMID: 13052700 Free PMC Article
Related citations
Select item 13052691
4.
Studies on copper metabolism. VII. Blood copper in pregnancy and various pathologic states.
LAHEY ME, GUBLER CJ, CARTWRIGHT GE, WINTROBE MM.
J Clin Invest. 1953 Apr;32(4):329-39. No abstract available.
PMID: 13052691 Free PMC Article
Related citations
Select item 13052690
5.
Studies on copper metabolism. VI. Blood copper in normal human subjects.
LAHEY ME, GUBLER CJ, CARTWRIGHT GE, WINTROBE MM.
J Clin Invest. 1953 Apr;32(4):322-8. No abstract available.
PMID: 13052690 Free PMC Article
Related citations
..................
In experimental settings, researchers gave healthy volunteers 4-8 mg of copper a day for 1 to 3 months without any adverse effects. Due to the efficient mechanism of copper homeostasis, even this high dosage didn’t change the plasma concentration.

Harvey et al 2003
Adaptive responses in men fed low- and high-copper diets.
Harvey LJ, Majsak-Newman G, Dainty JR, Lewis DJ, Langford NJ, Crews HM, Fairweather-Tait SJ.
Br J Nutr. 2003 Jul;90(1):161-8.

Turnlund et al 2005
Am J Clin Nutr. 2005 Apr;81(4):822-8.
Long-term high copper intake: effects on copper absorption, retention, and homeostasis in men.
Turnlund JR1, Keyes WR, Kim SK, Domek JM.
............

In a multicenter European study performed in 2000, researchers investigated the effect of extra copper on oxidative processes in the blood cells of middle aged people. Again, they were amazed that even 7 mg/day of copper taken during the 6 week period did not produce any increase in oxidative damage. On the contrary, it improved anti- oxidant defense

Rock et al 2000
The effect of copper supplementation on red blood cell oxidizability and plasma antioxidants in middle-aged healthy volunteers.
Rock E, Mazur A, O'connor JM, Bonham MP, Rayssiguier Y, Strain JJ.
Free Radic Biol Med. 2000 Feb 1;28(3):324-9.
..................
The only dietary source of copper that a person should worry about is in contaminated water, since it supplies inorganic copper not bio-complexes of copper. If you drink water that contains 4-8 mg of copper per liter as your only water source for several weeks, you may experience nausea and other gastric symptoms. However, such problems occur only in Third World countries, where water quality is low. In the United States drinking water does not contribute much to copper intake

Araya et al 2001
Copper deficiency and excess in infancy: developing a research agenda.
Araya M, Koletzko B, Uauy R.
J Pediatr Gastroenterol Nutr. 2003 Oct;37(4):422-9. Review.

..........
I could probably add another 50 of similar references.

Also for oral use of copper vs copper peptide creams, you will get more from the oral use. We once had the copper peptides tested for passing through human skin from cadavers and about 0.0014% of the copper passed through. So if you apply a skin product with 2 mgs of copper peptide about 0.0028 mgs would enter the blood.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Dr. Pickart,
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Location: SkinBioOffice
Registered: 23 December 2009
Posts: 535
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Dear Kristos282,

[QUOTE] Do Copper peptides have the same effect in the body as oral copper?

And, how many mg of copper do you consume when using a copper peptide cream daily? Do you have any idea? [QUOTE]

Copper Peptides (for the skin) and copper supplements or chelated (copper supplements) are not free copper entering your system. They are 2 different things.

From Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_toxicity

"Copper in the blood and blood stream exists in two forms: bound to ceruloplasmin (85–95%), and the rest "free", loosely bound to albumin and small molecules. Free copper causes toxicity, as it generates reactive oxygen species such as superoxide, hydrogen peroxide, and the hydroxyl radical. These damage proteins, lipids and DNA.[1] "

Is Copper Safe?
Very little copper from copper peptide skin products penetrates through the skin. Charged molecules such as copper and peptides have very poor penetration of the skin and tests of copper peptide products have found that only about 0.1% or less of the copper passes through the skin. In contrast, fatty molecules penetrate the skin much more easily.

One small two-week study on Skin Biology's Protect & Restore Cream found no changes in blood copper levels, or any other significant blood chemistry changes, when the product was applied twice daily (4 grams per day) for two weeks on six persons with irritated skin.

In summary, normal use of a copper peptide products might possibly result in a very small uptake of copper. For example, if one used 2 grams of product daily that contained 2 milligrams of copper, and if the skin uptake was at 0.1% penetration, this would introduce about 0.002 milligrams of copper into your body. If penetration through the skin was as high as 1%, your body uptake would still be about 0.02 milligrams or 1% of the RDA for copper.

This is one very small study using our copper peptides that shows that very little copper itself enters the body. So using copper peptides daily for the care of skin adds a negligible amount of copper to the body.

Best Wishes,
~TheSkinBioTeam
Location: Stockholm
Registered: 18 July 2014
Posts: 28
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Thanks, I'm very happy to hear that you can't get to much copper through using copper peptides.

I'm doing alot of thinking right now sinve I have some problems with my skin care regime. And I had some symtoms that might suggest too much copper, among other things, hairloss... But maybe I'm wrong about that.
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Location: Skin Biology
Registered: 15 September 2004
Posts: 7065
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I have never found any credible scientific reports of damage in humans from normal chelated copper intake at any reasonable dosage - up to 50 mgs per day. Copper chelated to amino acids or proteins is very safe.

The reports on damage come from taking large amounts on un-chelated copper, such as copper sulfate, or copper chelated to some types of toxic synthetic organic chemicals that never exist in the human body.
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