I just asked a co-worker for her opinion on the rash. I seemed to think that it was going away, and it's been now several hours after this mornings CP and emu oil routine. She agreed that the rash seems to be less red in appearance ! Since I'm still not sure if the turtleneck was the cause, I'd like to know if everyone would suggest that I skip tomorrow mornings CP and just use emu oil, I certainly don't want to have sagging skin and if so should I only use diluted CP everyother day?

I've gotten rash from using lower strength hydroxy acid than you are using on your neck on my face, so don't forget to adjust the 30% glycolic acid to avoid causing skin rash, too.

What is the 2 drop of serum you are mixing/diluting with Super Cop? Can the serum also cause the rash? http://healthyskin.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/647002...470055954#6470055954

You can also prep your skin with a bho or an antioxidant oil before you apply Super Cop or a lower strength SRCPs without diluting the SRCPs.

sorry, when I refer to the serum I'm talking about the Super Cop Serum, I'm mixing the Super cop with water, and then applying it to my wet face, therefore diluting it even more. This morning my neck is a litle itchy, but the red little bumps at the rash area are going away, and it less red than yesterday afternoon. The only flaky and dry/red areas are around my mouth. And I've had a problem with that area for the last year or so. I'm hoping that the emu oil clears that up. This morning I'm going to skip the Super cop, and just use emu oil as a moisturiser. Maybe I'll use the Super Cop tomorow morning adding water again with it.

Yes, the names can get very confusing. It took me a little while to get the names and the products straight. Super Cop is a cream and it's higher in strength than Super CP Serum. There is some hydroxy acid in Super CP Serum also.

The red little bumps are farily common in the beginning until the skin becomes acclimated to SRCPs in time. The mild immune response shall pass and is nothing to be concerned about as long as you don't escalate the inflammatory response further with the same strong actives or routine until your skin or neck has time to acclimate to your method. Again and in my experience, using a milder hydroxy acid and SRCPs at a higher frequency prevent this type of rash/breakouts from happening and can actually produce visible results much earlier and/or without any negative consequencs strangely enough. I think our skin and body has a way of adjusting to stimuli and can accept drugs/vitamins/skin actives better and protest less violently when the quilibrum (an inate intelligence for preservation) is not shocked but slowly adjusted up or down for an end result. Consistency pays off big time to affect a lasting change, but the body cannot be consistently accepting with strong stimuli (developing dis-ease) and thus no positive or permanent change. Physiologically and motivational wise, we all have the experience that we can manage to run 12 miles in one week much earlier and more easily by runing 1-2 mi daily for six or seven days in the beginning than by running 6 miles only twice per week. Same number of miles and in same amount of time... but the workload and results are not the same. We are pushing our muscles to take in more oxygen and grow but still within good limits that won't disable or stress our body with extreme stiff and sore muscles that slow or impede the momentum in achieving a fitness goal. Similarly with diet change, no one can become a vegan or develop an eating disorder overnight. The lifestyle change is systematic and conscious involving time. Since most of us start with Exfol or Super CP or CP Serum or lower on our face and build up a regimen from there (but using the strongest SRCPs is not the objective, however) to build healthy skin barrier or affect positive skin remodeling results while minimizing any negatives, it would seem a better idea to use those actives or even milder exfoliants and SRCPs/bho on the neck or allow longer acclimation time because the skin on the neck is more delicate and probably more sensitive than the face, but you'll have to find your own happy medium for your skin type and objective. Whether you should use Exfol instead of 30% glycolic acid at this time on your neck or not, using oils before applying SRCPs will slow the uptake of the active you put on afterwards and is another good option if you don't have milder SRCPs to use on your neck. This way there is not a stop and go and your skin can get the benefits of using SRCPs much quicker because of the consistency.

Diluting an active with water is another option, but I personally prefer not to alter the formulation of an active by dilution or using multiple actives simultaneously. Your skin barrier needs to be protected and moisturized anyways, especially if you are using stronger actives and unless your skin is exceptionally oily, I believe using a bho to modulate an active (reduce/increase penetration) is a better choice and saves you a step.

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Thanks very much for your reply. So if I understand you correctly, I should put the emu oil on first on my neck then apply the Super PC Serum on afterward, rather than skipping the CP serum entirely. That the stop and go won't allow my skin to become used to the SRCP and therefore may always be sensitive to the CP's. Also I think that the corner of my eyes are becoming droopy as well, either that or I'm retaining water. I usually take water pills and by tomorow morning if my eyes still seem puffy, then it must be the CP eye cream. I thought that since it's a lower concentration of CP in the cream I could use it everyday. Maybe I should apply it on top of the emu oil as well. Always thought that I wasn't sensitive, guess I am !

RE: RASH ON THE NECK & DROOPY EYES

Yes, either prep the skin with oil before Super CP Serum, use a milder CP, do both, diluting SRCPs, or skip SRCPs for a day or two for your neck and eyes. There are so many good workable options, you'll have to determine or test out which one works for you. However, I don't believe you need to use or dilute Super Cop (cream) for use around your eyes or neck if you have Super CP Serum on hands and when just starting out.

Consistency also doesn't mean you have to use the CPs you have DAILY on your neck or eyes. If you find that you are seeing more negative skin reactions than positive results using Super CP Serum daily even after you first prep your skin with a bho (dilution and etc.), then use it every other day or three. The best way is what works for your neck and eyes at the current time (things change) and not some arbitrary rules because there are always exceptions and differences (in biochemistry, health, taking water pills, and etc.), and the only way to know your preferences for sure is by doing and testing out the few logical options and combinations (even that may change from time to time, season to season, or changes to your skin barrier in these two areas). In general, with so many workable options and strengths of SRCPs available, there is little reason why someone (newbie or not) cannot find the right strength of SRCPs or application method for the skin in question with or without hydroxy acid and bho on a daily or some kind of consistent basis.

quote:

Originally posted by Sabina:
That the stop and go won't allow my skin to become used to the SRCP and therefore may always be sensitive to the CP's.

Not exactly but that is another way of looking at it. As long as the stop and go is somewhat on a regular basis, say at least monthyly(theoretically speaking but really undetermined), it's unlikely that one would have any sensitivities or develop one for SRCPs indefinitely, especially if one believes that SRCPs exists in tissues, plasma, and saliva and is one of the six natural skin activators suggested by Dr. Pickart. Any allergies toward SRCPs would have had happened in the first use, and the inflammatory or immune reactions would have been unmistakenly massive and not gradual.

The point about consistency of use (in hours or days for whatever you find best for your face/body areas you're working on) is to use a weaker active tolerable to the skin that can be used about 2x daily without causing negative transitory symptoms because it's easier to saturate the skin in small frequent doses of SRCPs throughout the day for greater positive results but safely than fix any negative temporary skin stress induced from using a combination of strong actives or from product overuse after the fact when induced temporary "uglies" are visible. There is no way to reduce or dilute what skin actives have been absorbed or processed by the skin. The only option by then is to rest the skin (stop & go) for a few days. Why not try to avoid or reduce the chance of uglies from happening in the first place? Building up in small doses is both easier on the skin and for the SRCPs user to find the maximum tolerable dose for best results without overstressing the skin unnecessarily. For most people or for daily care, there is probably no need to use SRCPs 2x daily around the neck or eyes, however. Skin remodeling these areas should be treated somewhat differently and may be with a milder conservative approach. Downtime (the stop & go) is necessary sometimes for scar reduction or deep skin remodeling due to intense spot treatments or the use of strong actives to allow the skin to recover a little and to reduce adverse complications, but downtime that actually slow the momentum and efficiency for overall skin renewal and healing is conveniently eliminated and unnecessary when on a mild actives high frequency regimen. Thus, other than for scar reduction or deep peels, the homeusers can generally achieve good to dramatic skin remodeling results but without the risks of complications associated with stronger actives in the same amount of time using milder bioactives for overall skin rejuvination. Consistency of use (low concentration and high frequency method for example) is a way of getting better results with less problems and in shorter amount of time like getting different results running the same 12 miles in a week (daily vs. twice a week) example I gave above.

In the short-term (usually around the first 3rd-14th day but lets say the first month) after you see most of your skin remodeling or the most dramatic visible results initially, you may have to adjust down your exfoliation even more (some SRCPs reduction but reduction of acid is more important at that point) in theory (and true in my case). With a thinner corneum stratum (the uppermost epidermis; dead cells) in the process of building a younger healthier and thicker skin barrier when done properly, you'll find your skin needs less exfoliation or that you're in tune to use milder actives to maintain the same effect (another way to avoid transitory uglies) after inital successes. Then a few weeks to a month after or so (different for differnt skin type and people), you may have to pick up on the exfoliation again.

Avoiding "stop and go" use of SRCPs or delivering small steady supplies of SRCPs to the skin throughout the day (or whatever schedule you find suitable) is also to encourage as much biochemical and cellular activities explained by Dr. Pickart to build collagen, elastin, and water-binding molecules, and the machinery requires SRCPs (with only a little help from hydroxy acid to do controlled damage to initiate the process). Can you push your largest organ to produce collagen and elastin fibers at good equilibrium without shutting it down? Since no one has a tool to measure or find that equilibrum precisely, SRCPs and bhos should be your primary actives used (not a strong acid unless you are remodeling scars) if you want good strong remodeling results without drooping, sagging, or wrinkles. It's what I do and I get results repeatedly. My experiences match the propsed theories even if my methods (both for rejuvination and scar reduction) may be viewed (incorrectly) as unconventional or aggressive when the low conentration high frequency method (and the ways I remodeled my age spot and pitted chickenpox scars) absolutely stressed my skin less yet produced results earlier without negative consequences or complications.

For treatment of neck and eyes, it's best to scale down the above approach slightly or even more (conservatively experimental and you have the best of both worlds) until you have some real feedback or have gained some successes and confidence from your actual product use.

However, any negative results you may experience is progress as long as you learn from the experiences. "No progress" or "bad results" is still progress in my view if you succeeded in getting results by making proper adjustments with your actives either in concentration or frequency of use, and I still value these experiences. Moreover, success doesn't continue indefinitely and negative skin reactions can come and go, especially for acne-prone skin.

If you keep getting bad results consistently, then you should review the theory of SRCPs in wound healing/skin repair, Dr. Pickart's writing, your method/assumptions/regimens, learn from people with similar issues, skin type, who has had successes, and then ask how and what can I do differently to get a different end result. After the initial trial period, you should have the answers or can find the answers in troubleshooting problems because no one knows your regimen or how your skin behaves toward SRCPs more than you.

quote:

I usually take water pills and by tomorow morning if my eyes still seem puffy, then it must be the CP eye cream. I thought that since it's a lower concentration of CP in the cream I could use it everyday. Maybe I should apply it on top of the emu oil as well. Always thought that I wasn't sensitive, guess I am !

If you post exactly how you are using actives around your eyes, maybe others can help you with what you should do with CP eye cream. I'd imgaine you could prep the area with a bho before using the CP eye cream or dilute the eye cream to see if they will make a difference.

I used Exfol/CP Serum periodically and moisturized my eyes multiple times a day with antioxidant oils around my eyes and had no adverse reaction but gradual fine line reduction.

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